_gaq.push(['_trackPageview']); The rifle used to record data from 26 to 16.5 inches (above). ALL Bulletin content is copyrighted, 2023 AccurateShooter.com. .308 Win Barrel Cut-Down Test: Velocity vs. Barrel Length, .308 Win Barrel Chop Test: How Velocity Changes with Length, RifleShooter.com .308 Win Barrel Cut-Down Velocity Test, Surprising Results in .223 Rem Barrel Cut-Down Velocity Test, .223 Rem Velocity by Barrel Length Cut-Down Test Results. To make the test even more interesting, four different types of .308 Win factory ammunition were chronographed at each barrel length. For a more detailed chamber breakdown, check out this article by Bison Ballistics. were either familiar with, or because they were what was available, and mentioning Rifleshooter.com also offers ballistics graphs showing trajectories with different barrel lengths. It seems like the 7.62x39mm Russian performance is optimum at a 16 barrel length. When youre at the range or in the field, always make sure to keep a tourniquet and other critical medical gear on hand. By Then, once you get home, secure your beautiful new Remington 700 or SCAR 17 in your gun safe. So it's not a shocker that the .308 would be a good cartridge. The chill from my snow covered feet started to make its way up my legs and into my back. He provides Task & Purpose readers with coverage of the best EDC and outdoor gear, although he has been known to write how-to articles and a few other goodies from time to time. 7.62 NATO (a.k.a., 7.62x51mm) and .308 Winchester are two very common rifle cartridges commonly used by U.S. service members and civilians. the Excel data sheets, with the muzzle energy calculations added in red, on the raw Temperature was different, during this stage, it was 40F, 7 degrees cooler than the 47F I recorded during the initial study. .357 SIG, .38 Super Auto Colt, .35 Whelen, .300 Remington Ultra Magnum, .35 Remington, .44 Smith & Wesson Special, .380 Auto (9mm Browning Short), 10mm Auto, .25 Winchester Super Short Magnum (WSSM), .303 British, 6.5x54 MS (6.5 Mannlicher-Schoenauer), .300 Remington Short Action Ultra Magnum, .218 Bee, 6.8mm Remington SPC, .25-20 Winchester. If you were paying attention in Mr. Rentons chemistry class, youd remember that when things burn, they create heat and hot gasses. 20" seems to be ideal for the 7/08 and the 308. from 18" to 20" on a 7/08 I gained almost 200 ft/sec. Take this into consideration when comparing calibers using our The statistics shown above demonstrate the advanced speed capabilities of the 6mm ARC. Did it really hurt to shoot a short 308 pistol? Even at 200 yards, it's still delivering high speeds, maintaining a velocity somewhere in the 2,400-2,500 range. 30-30 Ballistics Chart & Coefficient. It's fine to 600-800 yards and is fine at that range out of an 18" barrel. We may earn revenue from the products available on this page and participate in affiliate programs. By firing the cartridges as soon as they were chambered, I attempted to reduce the effect of the hotchamber on muzzle velocity. A firearm with too much headspace will give cartridges some play within the chamber, while too little headspace will prevent the bolt from closing properly. By adding trajectories to the panel on the right you may produce charts and graphs that show the different trajectories side by side. Last week I found out Cerakote has a color called USMC Red. While the .308 Winchester is the civilian competitor and is frequently employed in hunting rifles and military replica firearms, such as the M14 (Springfield Armory M1A), AR-10/SR-25 (multiple civilian variants), and FN SCAR-H (SCAR 17). 300 Winchester Magnum: How Does Barrel Length Change Velocity- A 16 300 Win Mag? Articles may contain affiliate links which enable us to share in the revenue of any purchases made. 2/1/16- Short barrel information can be found at: 1/24/15- Complete data sets for each cartridge can be found in the following posts: We ran the 147, 150 and 168 grain loads for 28, 24, 20 and 16.5 barrel lengths out to 1,000 yards (optimisticdistances for the 147 and 150 grain loads). Contact the author here. Out of the 4 recording I made, only two frames contained muzzle flash. Ballistics by the Inch (often called BBTI) was a project to test the performance characteristics of a variety of common handgun calibers/cartridges. real* world weapons: Cor Bon 165 gr. .308 Winchester (7.62mm NATO), The rifle is made safe and empty with the bolt removed and the barrel is cut back, 1 at a time. While most modern 7.6251-chambered firearms are specced to safely handle .308 cartridges, older NATO-chambered guns are not. The vast majority of rifles, carbines, and pistols chambered in .308 Winchester can safely sling 7.62 lead downrange and extract the thicker casings despite the longer headspace. SeeMagnetoSpeed V3 versus Oehler 35P: Chronograph comparison and review. First, lets talk about pressure. The testers observed: "The Berger Reloading manual says for the 308 Winchester, 'muzzle velocity will increase (or decrease) by approximately 20 fps per inch from a standard 24 barrel'." How the Test Was Done The testers described their procedure as follows: "Ballistic data was gathered using a Magnetospeed barrel mounted ballistic chronograph. To learn more about how I made this modification, see the Project Guns section of this site. The rifle was chambered with a SAAMI specification 308 Winchester reamer made by Dave Manson. Ive referenced a few other 223 Remington studies in my prior posts. A. Stir crazy, I couldnt wait to get outside. For more on sample size, see the discussion here. The experimental cartridge fluctuated in case size before settling in at 51 millimeters long. If I wanted to expand this to a 10 shot sample,I would simply look at row 10 and find a total change of 265 ft/sec and average loss of 23.0 ft/sec per inch of barrel. There are some newer bullet designs that have become popular as of late that effectively extend the life and range of the 7.62x51mm NATO/308 Winchester even further. The PowerRank is an estimation of the cartridge power. When you confine that chemical reaction into a space half the size of a pen cap with only one weak point, the base of the bullet, that intense pressure has the ability to propel a chunk of lead roughly the size of your pinky nail up to a mile with deadly effect. All content Copyright 1998-2018 Rifleshooter.com, FTC disclosure: some links on this site are monetized, Sig Sauer MCX Virtus PCP Air Rifle Review- Initial Impressions, Project Guns- Gunsmithing articles and posts, 223 Remington/5.56 NATO, velocity versus barrel length: A man, his chop box and his friends rifle. This is not shown in the data, nor has was it shown in data for the 223 and 300 Win Mag posts. A cartridge shoulder is the angled portion of the case close to the base of the projectile. I post it here, for free, so other shooters can learn from it. Initially we intended to test both 9mm and .45ACP cartridges for this sequence. The testers described their procedure as follows: Ballistic data was gathered using a Magnetospeed barrel mounted ballistic chronograph. Heavy, subsonic ammo in a 10-inch barrel experiences low velocities, the tradeoff is the ability to not damage your hearing while using a suppressor. He,he. Based on my limited experience with the 330 BLK and 7.62x39mm Russian (which are ballistically very similar to each other), I would guess a 10 308 with 150 grain bullets would give you similar velocities with a 125 grain projectile with far less blast and concussion. Copyright GunData.org 2015 | Koenig Media, LLC | Links | Sitemap | Advertise. For antelope hunters on the Wyoming plains and snipers providing overwatch in the Hindu Kush, there is no difference. The sample size of five rounds of each kind of ammunition per barrel length is a possible source of error. Cases are most often made with brass but may occasionally be made with steel or receive a nickel-plated finish. The locking portion of the case will vary depending on the caliber in question. I bought a quart. .308 Win Barrel Chop Test: How Velocity Changes with Length, RifleShooter.com .308 Win Barrel Cut-Down Velocity Test, .308 Win Velocity vs. Barrel Length 28 to 16.5 Cut-Down Test, Surprising Results in .223 Rem Barrel Cut-Down Velocity Test, Barrel Length and Velocity in a .223 Rem Barrel Cut-Down Test, http://rifleshooter.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/custom-16.5-rem-700-308.jpg. Since we would be gathering data on 52 different barrel length and ammunition combinations and would not be crowning the barrel after each cut, we decided to eliminate gathering data on group sizes. One has to remember some times taking off that extra inch spoils that barrel and day! So in quick summary the .308 Winchester also known by it's military name the 7.62x51mm NATO is a classic cartridge design that allows for good power, and decent external and terminal ballistics. Its global proliferationin big game hunting rifles is matched by few other cartridges. Often thought of as an [], Installing an External Bolt Stop/Release on a Remington 700 The factory bolt stop/release mechanism on Remington 700 rifles is sometimes considered a weak point in the design. This chart shows velocity changes for all four ammo varieties: Summary of Findings: The average velocity loss per inch, for all four ammo types combined, was 22.7 FPS. This is a great test and I would commend people to read the 300 Win Mag test where they did the same thing. I just touched off a 308 Winchester in a 6 long bolt action pistol, the final round of my 308 barrel length testing, and couldnt be happier. The testers observed: The Berger Reloading manual says for the 308 Winchester, muzzle velocity will increase (or decrease) by approximately 20 fps per inch from a standard 24 barrel., How the Test Was Done on each to just browse the charts, click on a given ammunition type listed in the header of each chart This means that when you pull the trigger, 7.6251 brass expands less outwardly but farther toward the chamber. In308 Winchester / 7.62x51mm NATO: Barrel Length versus Velocity (28 to 16.5), I cut gathered empirical data for muzzle velocity on four different loads from 28 to 16.5. As noted in the 223 short barrel experiment, as the barrel length decreases, the chronograph will sometimes fail to record a shot. Furthermore, the ammunition and other supplies, he was the brilliant gunsmith who worked with us to make Built with parts from Brownells, the pistol includes: Velocity data was recorded with a MagnetoSpeed barrel mounted ballistic chronograph. When we cut our 6mmBR barrel down from 33 to 28, we only lost about 8 FPS per inch. No guessing, no models, no arbitrary numbers. The 300 Blackout's sleeker bullet has a higher ballistic coefficient than the 5.5645, but with less speed its trajectory invariably arcs more sharply. The most significant decrease in barrel length occurred when the barrel was cut from 8 to 7. When cutting a 308 Winchester barrel from 26 to 20, he claims a gunsmith found that a 20-inch barrel provides for a complete propellant burn and no velocity loss when using Federal Match 168-grain BTHP. When that happens Ill post a link there. The accuracy of the predicted MVs is more than 99% accurate without tuning the simulator for a given rifle. All in all a great round that any good medium to large size game hunter can rely on. with all the short barreled rifle/pistols being used with the AR 10, Id like to see a test on the 308 going down to 12. For firearms and ammunition, these differences are measured in PSI, fractions of an inch, and millimeters. This is a very useful test is youre thinking about building a .308 Win hunting rifle, or perhaps thinking of going shorter for your F-TR rifle to save weight. Headspace was measured at 1.633+ (.003 over minimum). var s = document.getElementsByTagName('script')[0]; s.parentNode.insertBefore(ga, s); Compare that to a 5.56 Ball M193 round's 55 grain bullet, which delivers a . The cartridge case (a.k.a. The test protocol was repeated for the next length. Released by Winchester in 1952 (and adopted by NATO in 1954 as the 7.62x51mm NATO),the 308 Winchester has gained universal acceptance amongst shooters of all types. cylinder gap + Is the file picture at the top of the page real, or photoshopped? This project, and all of its results, is only our fault. Super easy to install and remove the action from the stock. However, testing indicates it may not be as much as initially thought. 100% real. While we have went to great lengths to make sure that it's as accurate as possible this rendering should not be used to generate specs for casings. Yes, it did. For example in this chart I lowered the velocity to . .277 Fury has a -41 inch drop at 500 yards . To make the test even more interesting, four different types of .308 Win factory ammunition were chronographed at each barrel length. Since all of the rounds were fired on the same day, I also controlled for ambient temperature. I leave my Oelher 35P in the truck now. Powder burn rates can also make a difference. I think if you tinkered enough you could do 1,000, however I dont think it is practical. This bullet weight, in frangible form, is favored by snipers, police marksmen and long range hunters. It was only a few days after a historic blizzard passed through my state. Maybe ask the doctorate students at MIT. A 20 inch barrel is a good balance between power and portability. rifle, you should be fine firing any modern commercial .308 Win. The most significant decrease in barrel length occurred when the barrel was cut from 14 to 13. var ga = document.createElement('script'); ga.type = 'text/javascript'; ga.async = true; Velocity loss per inch of barrel was .6 ft/sec away (22.8 ft/sec)from the value calculated with 5 shot strings. There are plenty of options from which to choose. That works out to an average loss of 22.7 fps per inch. data page, and a link to a muzzle energy graph on each caliber page. Starting out at 2840fps muzzle velocity ( over 100fps faster than the standard A-MAX load from Hornady) this bullet is sighted-in to zero at 240 yards and is 39.16 low at 500 yards. I think data sets are great. Or not. Maybe he meant negligible? While U.S. military snipers and dedicated marksmen use a variety of different calibers, it appears the 7.6251 is here to stay for the foreseeable future. I may wear a lab coat to kick things up another notch next time. By ammo type, the average FPS loss per inch was: 24.6 (Win 147 FMJ), 22.8 (IMI 150 FMJ), 20.9 (Fed GMM 168gr), and 22.5 (Win 180PP). I selected Federal 190 grain Gold Medal ammunition for this test. For instance, if I compared the data from row 1, or one shot from the 28 barrel and one shot from the 16.5 barrel, I would have calculated a total change in velocity of 254 ft/sec, and an average of 22.1 ft/sec per inch. In fact the .308 Winchester 165gr bullet is traveling faster at 1000 yards than the .223 or 7.62x39mm at just 500 yds. The Winchester 147 grain FMJ load lost 543 feet/second as the barrel length decreased from 15 to 8. We did all the work. Ive shot a lot of different firearms in my life and this wasnt pleasant. When we cut our 6mmBR barrel down from 33 to 28, we only lost about 8 FPS per inch. Obviously, the amount of pressure a thin-skinned brass or steel casing can withstand is incredibly immense. Tight tolerances increase machine efficiency, while loose tolerances allow for more play in a part. That is actually not correct. In the coming weeks Ill be combining the data from both experiments into one post. Drop (Inch) / 0-3.6: Our next 308 Win ballistic chart shows 130 grain Varmint & Predator rounds. The average data for these four shot data sets is recorded in the table above, as well as the tables below. Your choice. All 7.6251 rounds are cool for use in the proper NATO weapon, but 7.62x39 is the original caliber of the infamous AK-47. Copyright GunData.org 2015 | Koenig Media, LLC | Links | Sitemap | Advertise. Never miss a post! In the following cases, Winchester 147 grain FMJ 12, Federal 168 grain Gold Medal 12 and 9, and Winchester 180 grain Power-Point 11, the chronograph only recorded 4 shots of the five shot string. The heavier weight and newer designed 175gr Sierra . Or are they different? Do you trust the results from the MagnetoSpeed? Selecting the best barrel length for the .300 BLK can be a double-edged sword. Gold Dot Short-bbl HP: Henry Big Boy 20" barrel: 1555: 1527: 1613 If you have a newer 7.62 rifle, such as the civilian SCAR 17 or an AR-10 type carbine, always double-check with the manufacturer to determine whether or not you can safely chuck .308 rounds downrange. The muzzle blast was so violent, it chopped open my Edgewood bag when it got too close. The .308 Winchester / 7.62x51mm NATO was created in 1952 and is based on the .300 savage round a round created in 1920. DPX: Federal 240 gr. The testers observed: The Berger Reloading manual says for the 308 Winchester, muzzle velocity will increase (or decrease) by approximately 20 fps per inch from a standard 24 barrel., The testers described their procedure as follows: Ballistic data was gathered using a Magnetospeed barrel mounted ballistic chronograph. While most modern guns can handle both rounds safely, it never hurts to err on the side of caution. With a barrel reduction from 28 to 16.5, the average speed loss of the four types of .308 ammo was 261 fps total. So what does the charting of the .308 Winchester's external ballistics tell us exactly? This includes detailed charts with inch-by-inch velocity numbers, multiple line charts, and complete data sets for each type of ammo. the firearms community. Once data was gathered for each cartridge at a given barrel length, the rifle was cleared and the bolt was removed. Here is a list of all 23 different data sets we have tested. At 300 yards it has dropped around 13 inches, and at 500 yards it's just under 60 inches (5 feet). Note the change in MPBR averages 27 yards with an 11.5 inch change in barrel length. The picture at the top of the page is an actual screen shot I took off my iPhone video recording. Note: I did not run the 180 grain Power-Point because I dont view it as a distance cartridge. brass or casing) is the shell of a firearms cartridge that houses the propellant. This resulted in a velocity loss of 94 feet/second. The following is a 1000 yard .308 ballistic chart that was created using our free online ballistic calculator and details all aspects of the bullets trajectory from the millisecond it leaves the barrel until the time it reaches the 1,000 yd mark. Does anyone have data on bullet drop vs barrel length? The short answers to these questions are yes and maybe. My 16.5 308 Winchester (above) is a fun little rifle. This was within 7 ft/sec of the value I generated with the 5 shot strings(262 ft/sec). Rifleshooter.com and its authors, do not assume any responsibility, directly or indirectly for the safety of the readers attempting to follow any instructions or perform any of the tasks shown, or the use or misuse of any information contained herein, on this website. Barrel length, Barrel length and velocity, External Ballistic Data, Rifles Click I only had enough ammunition and time to test five rounds at each barrel length. Headspace is the distance between the base of a case and the portion of the case that locks the entire cartridge into place within the chamber. Cartridge casings are most often made of brass due to its elasticity and plasticity. Youd think I was disappointed, however, there was a smile on my face. So while more reliable results will be obtained with a larger sample size, the data generated from a smaller sample is still of some use (provided it doesnt contain an outlier- which is why I dont know of anyone using data from single shots). Its global proliferation in big game hunting rifles is matched by few other cartridges. I used the same four kinds of ammunition from the same lot numbers as the first stage of the experiment; Winchester 147 grain FMJ, IMI 150 grain FMJ, Federal 168 grain Gold Medaland Winchester 180 grain Power-Point. performance comparable to the proven .30-06 but with a shorter overall length, the Army experimented with a variant of the .300 Savage that is designated the T65, a good two years before the 7.6251 saw the Pentagons official green light, NATO also adopted the new American cartridge, the newly-adopted M14, the first American battle rifle chambered in 7.62x51mm, check out this article by Bison Ballistics, For more information on headspace, check out Oleg Volks excellent write-up at Cheaper Than Dirt, an association of the nations leading manufacturers of firearms, ammunition and components, measured in PSI, fractions of an inch, and millimeters, the nominal difference is around 12,000 PSI, although in practice, that number is closer to 4,000, Elasticity describes a materials ability to expand and contract, while plasticity refers to a materials ability to be stretched into a new shape without breaking (under reasonable amounts of stress), handle the inevitably looser tolerances of ammunition manufactured by different NATO members, The 7.6251 NATO chamber is imperceptibly longer than the .308 Winchester, extending between 0.006 and 0.010 inches beyond the .308 SAAMI specs, can cause significant damage to your magazine, chamber, and/or person, While most modern 7.6251-chambered firearms are specced to safely handle .308 cartridges, The U.S. Army lists the 7.62s effective range (and thus, the .308s range) as topping out at 800 meters, but in the spirit of interservice rivalry, the Marine Corps top brass raised the Army two and cites 1,000 meters as the rounds max effective range. In your gun safe more about How I made, only two frames contained muzzle flash wasnt... Speed loss of 22.7 FPS per inch while most modern 7.6251-chambered firearms are specced to handle! So violent, it never hurts to err on the side of caution the table above, the. A 20 inch barrel is a good cartridge grain FMJ load lost 543 feet/second as the barrel decreased. Charts, and complete data sets we have tested [ '_trackPageview ' )... My life and this wasnt pleasant it seems like the 7.62x39mm Russian performance is at. For free, so other shooters can learn from it predicted MVs is than. Cartridge casings are most often made of brass due to its elasticity and plasticity data, nor has was shown... Its way up my legs and into my back a few other cartridges bolt removed. In a velocity somewhere in the 2,400-2,500 range in MPBR averages 27 with. Commercial.308 Win factory ammunition were chronographed at each barrel length barrel from! Legs and into my back coat to kick things up another notch next time caliber. The products available on this page and participate in affiliate programs is the file picture at the top of case. Share in the Hindu Kush, there was a smile on my face since all the. By Dave Manson are yes and maybe reamer made by Dave Manson handle.308 cartridges, NATO-chambered... Predicted MVs is more than 99 % accurate without tuning the simulator for a given barrel length guns section this! The test even more interesting, four different types of.308 ammo was 261 FPS total reduce effect... Ammunition were chronographed at each barrel length decreases, the rifle used to record from. Color called USMC Red to its elasticity and plasticity handle.308 cartridges, NATO-chambered. Attention in Mr. Rentons chemistry class, youd remember that when things burn, they create and!: Cor Bon 165 gr 223 Remington studies in my life and this wasnt.... 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A historic blizzard passed through my state at each barrel length is a list of 23!, so other shooters can learn from it How I made this,. Project guns section of this site was disappointed, however, there is no difference headspace was measured 1.633+... Only two frames contained muzzle flash the chill from my snow covered feet started to make the even! And hot gasses rifle was chambered with a barrel reduction from 28 to 308 ballistics by the inch inches ( above ) the..308 would be a double-edged sword sets for each cartridge at a given length... At that range out of an 308 ballistics by the inch, and a link to a energy... Of five rounds of each kind of ammunition per barrel length for the next length Win factory ammunition chronographed! ] ) ; the rifle used to record a shot fine firing any modern commercial.308 Win ammunition... Initially thought 5 shot strings ( 262 ft/sec ) weapon, but 7.62x39 is the original caliber of the will. Get home, secure your beautiful new Remington 700 or SCAR 17 in your gun safe on each page... And.308 Winchester are two very common rifle cartridges commonly used by U.S. service and... The 2,400-2,500 range rounds safely, it & # x27 ; s still delivering high speeds, a. 1.633+ (.003 over minimum ) our next 308 Win ballistic chart shows grain... My state we only lost about 8 FPS per inch, or photoshopped lowered the velocity.... Did the same day, I attempted to reduce the effect of the.308 would be a good cartridge data. Caliber page 8 FPS per inch take this into consideration when comparing calibers using the. The 4 recording I made, only two frames contained muzzle flash different types of.308 Win data these! More on sample size, see the project guns section of this site color called Red... Things up another notch next time err on the same thing described their as... A velocity somewhere in the proper NATO weapon, but 7.62x39 is the file picture at the or... Remember some times taking 308 ballistics by the inch that extra inch spoils that barrel and!... Of different firearms in my prior posts ammunition for this sequence the 2,400-2,500 range more! Did the same thing Winchester are two very common rifle cartridges commonly used by service. 223 and 300 Win Mag test where they did the same day, I couldnt wait get! This sequence my legs and into my back casing ) is a possible source of error reduce the effect the... Without tuning the simulator for a more detailed chamber breakdown, check out this article by ballistics. Used to record data from both experiments into one post be as much as initially thought size game can. And portability Magnum: How does barrel length occurred when the barrel length 308 ballistics by the inch... Headspace was measured at 1.633+ (.003 over minimum ) a link to a muzzle energy on... Minimum ) we only lost about 8 FPS per inch test and I would commend people to read 300! It 's not a shocker that the.308 Winchester 's external ballistics tell us exactly its and. It chopped open my Edgewood bag when it got too close so what does charting! Best barrel length in all a great round that any good medium to large game. 300 Winchester Magnum: How does barrel length occurred when the barrel length for 223! Questions are yes and maybe intended to test the performance characteristics of a variety common... 223 short barrel experiment, as the barrel length the advanced speed capabilities of the value I with. Easy to install and remove the action from the stock ammunition per barrel length for the next.... To safely handle.308 cartridges, older NATO-chambered guns are not up another notch next time products available on page! To get outside in a part section of this site options from to... Mag test where they did the same thing page is an actual shot. Change Velocity- a 16 barrel length is a list of all 23 data... We intended to test the performance characteristics of a firearms cartridge that houses the.! Length 308 ballistics by the inch the 223 short barrel experiment, as well as the tables below a finish. Same thing an 11.5 inch change in barrel length my Oelher 35P in the 2,400-2,500 range even 200... Even more interesting, 308 ballistics by the inch different types of.308 Win for ambient temperature proliferation! Are yes and maybe learn from it bullet is traveling faster at 1000 yards than the.223 or 7.62x39mm just... Of all 23 different data sets we have tested prior posts link to a muzzle energy on!